Turkey Guide by Laochra(For Duels)
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A common misconception on atwar regarding 10k eu+ east duels is that Ukraine is better than Turkey. This is not true. The reality is that the vast majority of players just suck at Turkey. I can honestly list on 1 hand the number of players over the past few years who have developed good turks. This guide is aimed at correcting that. This guide will also help with imperialist gameplay in general across all settings and how to be efficient and creative when expanding. There are other turk guides on this forum. They're fine for beginners but most of them suck at a higher level. Personally i wouldnt use any of them. If you want to optimise your gameplay, this is the guide for you. I am pretty much past it in regards dueling, so i am happy to reveal this stuff now.
First things first, neutrals. Don't fail your neutrals. You often see guys sending the wrong amounts at neutrals t1 and then failing randomly and fucking up their game. Your inf havent 4 att so you cant just +2 inf vs the number of militia defending.The following amounts almost never fail. I say almost, most have never failed but i have seen some cases of freak rolls. Underlined are the configs i generally use t1 with turk. It is money dependent. On africa for example, you mightnt be able to afford to make any tanks at all.
1 Militia - 2 inf
2 Militia - 4 inf, 3 inf 1 tank, 2 inf 1 tank, 2 tanks
3 Militia - 5 inf, 4 inf 1 tank, 2 inf 2 tanks, 3 tanks
4 Militia - 7 inf, 6 inf 1 tank, 5 inf 1 tank, 4 inf 2 tanks, 4 tanks
5 Militia - 8 inf, 7 inf 1 tank, 5 inf 2 tanks, 4 tanks 2 inf, 5 tanks
6 Militia - 10 inf, 8 inf 1 tank, 6 inf 2 tanks, 4 inf 3 tanks, 1 inf 5 tanks
7 Militia - 11 inf, 10 inf 1 tank, 9 inf 2 tanks, 6 inf 3 tanks, 4 inf 4 tanks, 6 tanks
8 Militia - 13 inf, 11 inf 2 tanks, 8 inf 3 tanks, 4 inf 5 tanks
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General Tips:
Important Expansions
There are 4 key expansions you need to know for duels. There are many others like poland, austria and belarus rushes but these 4 and their variants are those that i have found to be the most consistently successful.
1. How to get rome t1 and full Italy t2.
This is the king of turk 1v1 expands and the most economical one there is. Players often dont realise that full italy is almost the same income as full rc. the trans should reach caligari t2. The rest you can take from naples and rome. Learn this expand. youll have 1k income on the start of t3. It allows for explosive expands, rushes and even an at if you want to attack a surprise target. Don't underestimate the power of a sucker kiev rush. Talk to Don.
2. How to get Russia South t1.
This is a pretty solid all round expand. Particularly useful vs the tank/inf based strats and gw which rely on the rostov and odessa ports to pressure turk. You can lockoff that option from them. It also leaves plenty of units to stack the balkans with should you fear a rush. And it has a nice little income boost as a side bonus.
3. How to get hungary t1 with an AT.
People have posted the expand so i am not reposting but it is pretty easy to do anyway. The at gives you options of attack or expansion behind enemy lines. You could also use it to get into scandi or benelux early.
4. Basic Turk.
This expand is simple, gives you lots of options and counters rushes.
Common Mistakes
GW Ukraine
I have decided to add a section on this particular ukraine strat since it gives people a lot of trouble. Many players think it is op. If you are efficient and meticulous, gw ukraine is actually easy to beat even in the hands of a top tier player. This is because in Ukraine it almost always tries to do the same thing and it has several exploitable weaknesses. Their t1 expand will nearly always contain rnw and rc. Then some combo of poland belarus, lith/latvia and rs and in some cases austria or hungary. The best thing to do is play gw yourself to figure out its limitations. Heres what you need to know.
1. There will be minimal cap pressure. Gw is not a rush strat and in order to ankara rush, they can only use ats or russia south. If you get russia south youve almost nothing to worry about other than perhaps a few stray marines hitting turk cities. What this means is that you can focus most your units freely on expansion. I should also mention that even if they do cap you it is extremely difficult for them to reinforce and hold. Expensive transports and low range militia arent a good combo. This is unless they succeeded in getting some of turks cities too. Specifically izmir istanbul and bursa. Otherwise recapping should be no problem.
2. T1 gw cannot contest expansion. If the ukraine player tries it then they are not playing gw properly and will likely get wrecked. Gw is all about expansion and grabbing as much spawn as possible. Gw is the weakest strat in the game at contesting expansion due to the stats of the starting inf. That means that if you go hungary austria rs or belarus and they do. They will lose and this will hurt them a lot. T2 their expansion contesting ability improves a little with the free militia from expansion. If they went hungary or austria. You should stack the surrounding cities in case they try to grab more land in that area. You can take the periphery less relavant balkan cities later. If you retain the full balkans(or almost) t5 then they're pretty fucked. This leads to my next point.
3. After t2/3 expansion the ukraine player will have marines maneuvering towards the balkans. Don't worry too much about latemoves t3. If you think a city will be latemoved, just make sure there is no spawn left in it. Expand and grab spawn. You can easily recap since they cant reinforce the cities without using expensive ats. For them it is not a worthwhile investment. T4 you can almost always guarantee that they'll try and take 1 or more of your main balkan capitals. Austria hungary serbia and romania specifically are under threat Since thats where the marines will mainly be. Again use the tb/priorities system to your advantage defensively. As your last moves shift units into cities likely to be hit. Similarly pull units out of unlikely cities to be hit late and move them into high priority ones. For example put slovak militia in hung or austria. pristina militia into bulgaria. Varna militia into romania. Or move bulgaria infantry into serbia, then into hungary in case thats hit. I hope i am being clear on what i mean here.
4. No matter which turk expansion you pick you should be looking at 160-210 units at the start of t5. A successful gw ukraine will be doing well if they manage around 130. If theyve more it is probably because you let turk cities get taken or lost half your balkans. So there is no reason you shouldnt be able to outspam them and beat them lategame.
A game i spectated recently between acqui and commando is a good example. Acqui did a standard italy t1 expand and full ita t2. Commando went poland, and then poland cities, czech and slovak. Acqui had double walled and walled bursa and izmir. He had left too many units behind in Turkey and his expansion suffered as a result. His upper balkan presense wasn't strong enough. Commando gained too strong a foothold in the upper balkans and outspammed him as a result. Keep them out of the balkans and you can wreck them lategame.
DS Ukraine
Another ukraine strat people seem to have trouble with. Personally I believe Turk has the advantage in this battle. Ds ukr has to take a lot of risks to gain advantage. They either need to full rush the balkans or they need a partial rush on 1 or 2 of the main balkan caps in order to slow your expansion.
1. If a ds player full rushes your balkans, just try and grab spawn whereever possible and dont be afraid to use anti-airs. A turk player should always leave a rein or 2 in ankara/istanbul for that purpose. Maybe divert 4 units to a city like switz etc for money but pull all the rest of your units into range of turk to hold. If they havent expanded, they have to either kill or cripple you by t5 or theyre fucked. __
2. For Slowroll DS plays you need to secure the money. Firstly you need full italy asap so you can go on the offensive. Then you need to get as much spawn as possible. t4 you recap anything youve lost.
- A ds slowroller wants to get to a point where they can spam helis and go fully on the offensive. For that they need to establish themselves in the west, specifically bene and london/paris.
- Use your italy units to push hard on that area. If you engage in a tradeoffs with them, swapping the countries back and forth its enough as it reduces the income of that area through collateral and prevents them establishing the 100% income. Divert some units to spain and snowball through that area to drive them from the west.
- Even a ds with full scandi and russia can be slowrolled against as long as it is kept out of the bene/paris london region and prevented from uniting full germany(theyll get berlin but thats only a 250 income cap. There's no reason you should let them get full country bonus.)
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Overall Turk is a fun country once you master it. You'll feel like a boss once you master it. But you need good micro and fast hands. Anyway if i think of anything else i'll add to this. Feel free to ask any questions. Enjoy the Autism.
Edit: This is marked for duels as it is the focus. But there is lots of useful info for teamgames here too.
First things first, neutrals. Don't fail your neutrals. You often see guys sending the wrong amounts at neutrals t1 and then failing randomly and fucking up their game. Your inf havent 4 att so you cant just +2 inf vs the number of militia defending.The following amounts almost never fail. I say almost, most have never failed but i have seen some cases of freak rolls. Underlined are the configs i generally use t1 with turk. It is money dependent. On africa for example, you mightnt be able to afford to make any tanks at all.
1 Militia - 2 inf
2 Militia - 4 inf, 3 inf 1 tank, 2 inf 1 tank, 2 tanks
3 Militia - 5 inf, 4 inf 1 tank, 2 inf 2 tanks, 3 tanks
4 Militia - 7 inf, 6 inf 1 tank, 5 inf 1 tank, 4 inf 2 tanks, 4 tanks
5 Militia - 8 inf, 7 inf 1 tank, 5 inf 2 tanks, 4 tanks 2 inf, 5 tanks
6 Militia - 10 inf, 8 inf 1 tank, 6 inf 2 tanks, 4 inf 3 tanks, 1 inf 5 tanks
7 Militia - 11 inf, 10 inf 1 tank, 9 inf 2 tanks, 6 inf 3 tanks, 4 inf 4 tanks, 6 tanks
8 Militia - 13 inf, 11 inf 2 tanks, 8 inf 3 tanks, 4 inf 5 tanks
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General Tips:
- Whatever expansion you use, minimise the number of transports you use. For example a transport made in izmir/istanbul can drop units off for serbia and then be pulled back to the coast to be refilled for greece. You shouldnt be making more than 3 transports for any expansion. Most require 2.
- For example I can use the Izmir trans to drop units off for serbia and then double drop 2 stacks of 15 into athens. It is tight on range but easy enough to do.
- Turkeys main strength is its' unit prod. It is a spam country. Mix 1-3 tanks vs neutrals t1 to conserve infantry. Don't expand with naked infantry. You are just wasting inf that can be later used for defence and further expansion. There is a balance to be found here. At the end of t1 you want 800+ money. So do not make so many tanks and transports that you are left with nothing. At the end of t4 if you use all your reins without having to spam militia or without having lots of excess cash then you've found the balance. I sometimes fuck this up myself, especially when rusty.
- T1 focus on the main balkan capitals. No ukraine will airdrop onto albania/bosnia t1. Well i have seen idiots do it but thats another story. Generally speaking if someone will contest your balkans they will focus on the main capitals. Either send minimum or stack them a bit.
- This is the same for T2. focus on hungary/austria etc. They also have significant income. T3 you can go for periphery cities. Again Turk is a spam country. Take every neutral in your path and maximise your unit prod.
- An efficient and economical turk can in theory drop 150 onto kiev before t9. I have done over 130 in practice. This is after units lost on wfs, tbs and general defense.
- Don't forget about the numbers advantage in battles. The more you outnumber a target the better your rolls and the less casualties you take. This is why we overstack neutrals t1. It is also why i overstack against enemy player targets where possible. This is extremely important with Turkey. This is also why people accuse me of having unit spam hacks and op imp rolls. I am not a hacker, I am just efficient.
- If you are balkan rushed by an opponent who commits most his army to the lower balk t1. I find retaining greece is essential as a turk reinforcement swivel point. You can afford to lose everything else. But whatever you do dont become predictable. Vary your expansions. Maybe stack bulgaria 1 game and not touch it the next. Maybe overstack romania 1 game with gen and send minimum the next. You get the idea.
- Istanbul is turks richest city and a key port for pressure on ukraine, don't lose it. Romania greece and the upper balkans are also key sources of income that are not to be underestimated.
- Pay attention to map income. This region alone has 661 income - more than Russia Central. Slovenia is the richest 1 rein city in europe at 80 income. These things add up especially when you're imp.
Important Expansions
There are 4 key expansions you need to know for duels. There are many others like poland, austria and belarus rushes but these 4 and their variants are those that i have found to be the most consistently successful.
1. How to get rome t1 and full Italy t2.
This is the king of turk 1v1 expands and the most economical one there is. Players often dont realise that full italy is almost the same income as full rc. the trans should reach caligari t2. The rest you can take from naples and rome. Learn this expand. youll have 1k income on the start of t3. It allows for explosive expands, rushes and even an at if you want to attack a surprise target. Don't underestimate the power of a sucker kiev rush. Talk to Don.
2. How to get Russia South t1.
This is a pretty solid all round expand. Particularly useful vs the tank/inf based strats and gw which rely on the rostov and odessa ports to pressure turk. You can lockoff that option from them. It also leaves plenty of units to stack the balkans with should you fear a rush. And it has a nice little income boost as a side bonus.
3. How to get hungary t1 with an AT.
People have posted the expand so i am not reposting but it is pretty easy to do anyway. The at gives you options of attack or expansion behind enemy lines. You could also use it to get into scandi or benelux early.
4. Basic Turk.
This expand is simple, gives you lots of options and counters rushes.
Common Mistakes
- Imp turk is king. Almost anything pd turk can do imp can do better. The exception being a t3/4 rush.
- Don't be that guy who expands t1 as imp then fucks all his units into lviv and istanbul for a t3 kiev rush. It is a shitty way to play turk and it wont work vs any half decent ukraine. A good turk can outslowroll anything. Even the dreaded gw ukraine. Learn.
GW Ukraine
I have decided to add a section on this particular ukraine strat since it gives people a lot of trouble. Many players think it is op. If you are efficient and meticulous, gw ukraine is actually easy to beat even in the hands of a top tier player. This is because in Ukraine it almost always tries to do the same thing and it has several exploitable weaknesses. Their t1 expand will nearly always contain rnw and rc. Then some combo of poland belarus, lith/latvia and rs and in some cases austria or hungary. The best thing to do is play gw yourself to figure out its limitations. Heres what you need to know.
1. There will be minimal cap pressure. Gw is not a rush strat and in order to ankara rush, they can only use ats or russia south. If you get russia south youve almost nothing to worry about other than perhaps a few stray marines hitting turk cities. What this means is that you can focus most your units freely on expansion. I should also mention that even if they do cap you it is extremely difficult for them to reinforce and hold. Expensive transports and low range militia arent a good combo. This is unless they succeeded in getting some of turks cities too. Specifically izmir istanbul and bursa. Otherwise recapping should be no problem.
2. T1 gw cannot contest expansion. If the ukraine player tries it then they are not playing gw properly and will likely get wrecked. Gw is all about expansion and grabbing as much spawn as possible. Gw is the weakest strat in the game at contesting expansion due to the stats of the starting inf. That means that if you go hungary austria rs or belarus and they do. They will lose and this will hurt them a lot. T2 their expansion contesting ability improves a little with the free militia from expansion. If they went hungary or austria. You should stack the surrounding cities in case they try to grab more land in that area. You can take the periphery less relavant balkan cities later. If you retain the full balkans(or almost) t5 then they're pretty fucked. This leads to my next point.
3. After t2/3 expansion the ukraine player will have marines maneuvering towards the balkans. Don't worry too much about latemoves t3. If you think a city will be latemoved, just make sure there is no spawn left in it. Expand and grab spawn. You can easily recap since they cant reinforce the cities without using expensive ats. For them it is not a worthwhile investment. T4 you can almost always guarantee that they'll try and take 1 or more of your main balkan capitals. Austria hungary serbia and romania specifically are under threat Since thats where the marines will mainly be. Again use the tb/priorities system to your advantage defensively. As your last moves shift units into cities likely to be hit. Similarly pull units out of unlikely cities to be hit late and move them into high priority ones. For example put slovak militia in hung or austria. pristina militia into bulgaria. Varna militia into romania. Or move bulgaria infantry into serbia, then into hungary in case thats hit. I hope i am being clear on what i mean here.
4. No matter which turk expansion you pick you should be looking at 160-210 units at the start of t5. A successful gw ukraine will be doing well if they manage around 130. If theyve more it is probably because you let turk cities get taken or lost half your balkans. So there is no reason you shouldnt be able to outspam them and beat them lategame.
A game i spectated recently between acqui and commando is a good example. Acqui did a standard italy t1 expand and full ita t2. Commando went poland, and then poland cities, czech and slovak. Acqui had double walled and walled bursa and izmir. He had left too many units behind in Turkey and his expansion suffered as a result. His upper balkan presense wasn't strong enough. Commando gained too strong a foothold in the upper balkans and outspammed him as a result. Keep them out of the balkans and you can wreck them lategame.
DS Ukraine
Another ukraine strat people seem to have trouble with. Personally I believe Turk has the advantage in this battle. Ds ukr has to take a lot of risks to gain advantage. They either need to full rush the balkans or they need a partial rush on 1 or 2 of the main balkan caps in order to slow your expansion.
1. If a ds player full rushes your balkans, just try and grab spawn whereever possible and dont be afraid to use anti-airs. A turk player should always leave a rein or 2 in ankara/istanbul for that purpose. Maybe divert 4 units to a city like switz etc for money but pull all the rest of your units into range of turk to hold. If they havent expanded, they have to either kill or cripple you by t5 or theyre fucked. __
2. For Slowroll DS plays you need to secure the money. Firstly you need full italy asap so you can go on the offensive. Then you need to get as much spawn as possible. t4 you recap anything youve lost.
- A ds slowroller wants to get to a point where they can spam helis and go fully on the offensive. For that they need to establish themselves in the west, specifically bene and london/paris.
- Use your italy units to push hard on that area. If you engage in a tradeoffs with them, swapping the countries back and forth its enough as it reduces the income of that area through collateral and prevents them establishing the 100% income. Divert some units to spain and snowball through that area to drive them from the west.
- Even a ds with full scandi and russia can be slowrolled against as long as it is kept out of the bene/paris london region and prevented from uniting full germany(theyll get berlin but thats only a 250 income cap. There's no reason you should let them get full country bonus.)
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Overall Turk is a fun country once you master it. You'll feel like a boss once you master it. But you need good micro and fast hands. Anyway if i think of anything else i'll add to this. Feel free to ask any questions. Enjoy the Autism.
Edit: This is marked for duels as it is the focus. But there is lots of useful info for teamgames here too.
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Good guide  clovis and lao stop fighting pls ty 
---- ''Everywhere where i am absent, they commit nothing but follies'' ~Napoleon 
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Freeman Konto skasowane |
Freeman Konto skasowane  >Duel guide >Don't know how to wall Istanbul  >Sry, couldn't help it >clovis, you owe me one now
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Nice guide but honestly a lot of people here are overcomplicating this so much lol, theres only so many options you can do at this stage.
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Bro samsung costs like $1000
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Xaxaxaxaxa
---- ''Everywhere where i am absent, they commit nothing but follies'' ~Napoleon
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lol what you buying S8+?
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tbs and positioning are part of game though, imp has more op tbs, especially vs the most powerful ukr, sm. Positioning can be used to cut Ukraine off from defending cities (even if sm, ats aren't infinite) and then use stacking/walling to retake with little loss.
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Note 7
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Just for the record. Theses three players have all solid Turk and I do consider them at the top level. I would say that Heat Check got the most solid and strongest Turkey of all the times. The majority of us (specially Dino) doesn't attempt to meticulously play the country though. It makes sense to a spectator to see us play and discover that we just did some R6 random mistake. CWs doesn't influence on it. It comes to important matches (like tournaments, deciding season cws, etc) when people like Heat shines the best. You can only gauge their true potential there. Of course the above is entirely my opinion and I'm not gonna convince anyone to believe that. It is rather very very subjective. Just commenting in case some readers needs another stance. Consider that I was speaking on their peaks and the nowadays reality might be different.
I disagreed until I tested it out. Spammed only tanks/ sea transports and overstacked everything I had with them. By T3 I had a pretty strong amount of units even beating the pure-infantry Turkey gameplay. Shocking reality. Whenever overstack to conserve units or expand as much as possible. I would do whatever gives me the maximal reinf count in the next turns. Here overstacking countries like Macedonia/Bosnia doesn't makes sense at all, but Austria/Hungary does. Expanding too much rewards you on lategame but doesn't gives you the flexibility to rush or defend (for example). It really depends on Turkey's lategame plans. One must know when to do the one or the other.
The whole idea of T2 counts fails if your opponent rushes you. But it's a lot more reliable than late calculations because is the least influenced by the game outcome ( what you / your opponent plans or perform).
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Pretty solid point there. Don't think I could'be said it any better.
I'd also suggest to do a lot of walls as well. Personally I like to wall between odessa/kiev a lot. Sometimes I extend the wall from lithuania to sevastopol (using liviv as a key positioning point). That safeguard you Balkans most of the times.
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Hey guys i see you've quoted my saying about making nearly only tanks turn 1. I would like to add something. This strategy works for 3vs3. For a 1vs1 I've found that you need more money to keep expanding so that you can't use that. Though when i was saying that it's important to keep tanks for turn 2. It's because you want to use them next turn so that you keep loosing the less infs possible. In a 3vs3 when in nearly every case, turkey players are having the same area of expanding until turn 5 ( Balkans and upper balkans ), you just want to loose the less units in the process. I'll add my little something that i think you both simply forgot to talk about. Azerbaidjan that can and is really good to be taken at turn 2 with 3 Tanks - 3 infs. For that you need to send 1 inf 1 tank to georgia port turn 1 and 2 inf 2 tanks to georgia capital turn 1. Turn 2 you send 3inf 3 tanks to azerbaidjan. Turn 3 you take Armenia Turn 4 you can bring a nice package of troops back to ankara to protect your cap ( usually around 8/10 ) Nice post Lao
---- Only the Braves
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Nice post, two things I'd like to add there
You don't always win Georgia with enough units to take Azerbaijan next turn.
That role combination is not good mkay... but 1 inf 1 tank from samsun, 2 inf 2 tanks from diya doesn't allows you to perform better. What I do when I'd like to lategame and I'm not taking full Caucasus is to sacrifice Georgian port to send 3 infs 3 tanks into Armenia. Since I'm adding extra units there's more hope that I get enough T2 to take Azer. Although I agree that taking Azerbajian so early is great for units prod, it isn't a flexible at all. Only things you can do after is to rush Russia South (mean move) or get near Georgia port (as you said). In the second option you're already setting yourself for defend. What if, say, something happens on the west, and you have to rush Kiev? Then any reaction you do would rely in the Balkans troops (making Caucasus troops useless). There are ways to override this, like, leaving a trans in Sevastopol for chaining t4 and perhaps mixing Caucasus units with other units to get enough range. But theses are all very specific moves which you'll hardy get together in a game. Not saying is a bad move, but it forces you to take a position there. For the readers though, a great tip for team games is to advice what yall are gonna be into. When you do theses expansions you should see stuffs like the ones I named coming. Let your team know, so they can plan accordingly. Something on the likes on "I'm going to slow roll this X guy, but I won't be able to rush him before Y turn". Don't just randomly let your team get gangbanged by surprise when you knew that your opponent would ignore you.
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I like the idea but it gives you even less flexibility before turn 5 since you probably won't be able to retrieve your unit back in ankara. Also it depends on the time you are making the rush decision. If it's on turn 2 you just don't go azer. Another point is, being rushed or not by ukraine, you want to retrieve at least 10 unit to your cap. That way other unit can be used in balkans. You can also decide to go RS port with those units. You have a bit more flexibility than what you think ! In anycase we're talking about slight things of the gameplay. But i would list it as an important move.
---- Only the Braves
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I agree clovis and laochra do ukr pls...
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Ive beaten your ukr quite comfortably and ive seen others do so too. Bearing this in mind i don't see how you can think of turk as weaker. The only point i will concede in that regard is ukraines greater range of strategy choices and in extension expansion choices. But turk can handle all of them if they are able to indentify your strat. I must hone in on some of these points for clarity.
But that has to be the case. Ukraine starts with 48 units. Turk starts with 79. Ukraine needs expansion to try and catch up.
There are ways to deal with that that i must add to the guide. But this is a very situational point anyway. Turk can also latemove and tb. It can also airdrop to rc and rrnw. Ukraine has to fear this too. Or someone dumping 10 unts by at into lith/latvia or belarus t2.
I made this guide to stomp this attitude out. It's weak and wrong and lazy. 3 of the 5 players who upvoted your post i would identify as solid ukraines but horrible turks. This will never change with players of your caliber giving them excuses. I wouldn't mind if you were right. Btw i could literally take this statement and repeat it for ukraine and id be perfectly correct in doing so.
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I don't intend to do other countries. I singled out turk because people struggle with it. I'll update it by the end of the week hopefully. Ill add some of clovises points and throw in a section on handling the dreaded gw ukraine. I must also add some tips on micro and using tbs defensively. A lot of this stuff is important in general not just with turk. In for a penny in for a pound, ill try and make the guide complete.
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He is right about the fact that turk cant pressure most ukraines lands.. Havent had my RNW or Moscow unwalled by a turk in months  Its why i sometimes dont even wall them and just leave them with 0,and ukraines starting cash and whatever powerhouse strategy it picks allows it to have range to unwall every turk city..winning strategy for ukraine that i found that can be devestating for turk is when ukraine does a semi-rush semi-expansion t2. Basicly take at least 1 balkan country from turk and use rest of reinforcements for expansion. Imp turk will have to waste units to retake the country forcing him to lower his expansion and ukraine to get bigger and stronger. Have played lb ukraine lately and have noticed that in 3v3/2v2 imp turk always loses to it as ukraines infs and tanks are just too op for turkey 
---- ''Everywhere where i am absent, they commit nothing but follies'' ~Napoleon
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Well. even if your opponent has east and north europe if you managed to preserve south and north balkans and preferably arrived west until the second recuitment round (turn 5) you are in advantage because you can defend with barely no cost now. what is hard is to push and protect poland/belarus but you don't have to do it if you just want to rush Kiev to win.
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For me the most important thing in ukr-turkey duel is number of trans. If u have 3at with ukr or 3nt with turk t1 u cant win that duel. 1at, 1nt for ukr, turk is enough for t1. It is better to keep the money for t2 when you buy 1extra at and try to steal some land
----  Fears are strong
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1 at for ukr? suicide min expansion, unless you're talking about blitz, sm or ds. imho it requires at least two ats.
Agree about that, i tend to put 15 in lviv or 10 in lithuania t2
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---- Fears are strong
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you cant always rely on rush. and you cant win by only defending.
---- ''Everywhere where i am absent, they commit nothing but follies'' ~Napoleon
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---- Fears are strong
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---- Don't ever look down on someone unless you're helping him up. Don't ever treat someone else the way you wouldn't want others to treat you. We're all people. 
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I'd say being stingy on transports is strong in 3v3, in 1v1 you need a good balance between money and expansion, you need very early footholds into income areas to make lategame vs a good ukr. Otherwise even with all your money ukr will push you off while gaining more and more income.
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rush ?
---- Fears are strong
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what is rush
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join MK and u will see
---- Fears are strong
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Play vs Domo*
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